Author Topic: Cubs in '18  (Read 75702 times)

Ron

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1110 on: December 19, 2017, 07:47:44 pm »
I don't take the idea of a trade for Machado seriously.  That said, it's worth noting that Machado is all of five months older than Baez, so an extension would make such a trade a whole lot more conceivable.

guest61

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1111 on: December 19, 2017, 07:54:06 pm »
As much as Machado would cost he'd surely take us out of the Bryce Harper sweepstakes.

So who would you rather have?

Probably Harper because he may help us keep Bryant.

ticohans

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1112 on: December 19, 2017, 07:54:23 pm »
All of Russell, Baez, and Happ are objectively worth more than one year of Machado.

I don’t believe the rumors, but if they’re real, one of two things is happening:

1) We’re trading one of the MI’s, but not to Baltimore. Instead, one of the MI trio is being dealt elsewhere for cost-controlled SP, thus clearing a spot for Machado.

2) We’re trading one of the MI’s to Baltimore, but it’s for more than just Machado.

Jes Beard

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1113 on: December 19, 2017, 08:45:49 pm »
Career 3.42 ERA, last year 3.86. 
*Over is career, he's basically been a 6-inning-per-start guy.
*Career average is 1.0 HR/game, lower early in his career, higher lately. 
*Turns 32 this summer. 
*The hope will be that he can maintain his stuff and his performance for several years, but it's obviously probable that at some point during the contract is stuff is going to decline to some extent going into his mid-30's. 
*Fastball has good velocity, but not especially good movement.  (Sometimes hitters anticipate fastball against good-fastball guys, but still can't kill it because the life is good.  Houston killed them.) 

Seems like a solid pitcher, very good, I'd love to get him, and the 2018 Cubs will probably be a LOT more competitive with him than with Lackey or some back-end rotation filler.  So I'm fired up about the possibilities.  I'm also guessing that he's got stuff so that on his better days, he can probably be really good.  Hopefully some of those will be in October and November.  But I can't expect him to be great, he's a 3.42 guy who gives up a lot of HR's, and who probably uses a lot of pitches to get through his 6 and once-in-a-while 7 innings.   

Kyle Hendricks is sort of the Rodney Dangerfield of the Cubs' pitching staff, and perhaps of major league pitchers in general.

In 2016 he had an ERA+ of 196, 25 points better than next best Jon Lester and 60 points better than Arrieta.  Hendricks' FIP in 2016 was 3.20, meaningfully better than Lester's 3.41.... and we all know how important and telling the FIP is.... except when it isn't because it doesn't fit our agenda.

In 2017, despite physical problems that put him on the DL and caused his ERA to bloom to a completely uncharacteristic 4.09 in the first half, he finished again with the best ERA, best ERA+ and best FIP on the team, largely thru a 2nd half ERA of 2.19, close to repeating his 2016 full season ERA of 2.13.  His ERA+ in 2017 -- 144, 21 points better than the 2nd best on the team.

So how did Darvish compare?  An ERA+ of 118 in 2017 and 134 in 2016, well below Hendricks -- Darvish was at 134 in his better year, while Hendricks was at 144 in his weaker year.

From 2012-2017

Darvish is 18 in fWAR despite being between 200-400 IP behind most of the people ahead of him on the list. Lester and Quintana 9th and 10th.

He is 15th in ERA- (Hendricks is 4th, so put what weight you want into this stat.

Darvish would easily be the Cubs #1 starter.

Yup.  Unless Lester somehow reverts to 2016 form Yu would be the de factor #1 guy.  He'd be the projected Game 1 starter.  Hard to overstate how much of an impact a guy like that has on your team.

Darvish will be 32 next year, an age when most pitchers are NOT improving and are often showing some decline.

Hendricks will be 28, an age when many pitchers are still showing improvement.

Darvish has a WAR the last two years of 5.8; Hendricks has an 8.5

In the world where actual performance on the field is less important than what a pitcher register on a radar gun, Darvish might well be the staff ace in 2018 if the Cubs add him.

In the world where actual on the field performance is more important, Hendricks would be the likely ace, and Darvish a very nice #1 or 2.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the idea of the Cubs signing him.  I simply do not believe he would likely be the best starter on the team in 2017.  What he would almost certainly do, however, is to help the Cubs field a rotation of at least four very strong starters.  Good move.

guest61

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1114 on: December 19, 2017, 10:00:50 pm »
The best way to sign a 5th starter is to sign a 1 and move the rest back a spot.

I cant hate on it.

ben

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1115 on: December 19, 2017, 10:03:46 pm »
Jes, that's a good post re Hendricks. 

"Hitting is timing, pitching is the destruction of timing."  Hendricks does that incredibly well, which is why his WAR is as it is.

Jes Beard

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1116 on: December 19, 2017, 10:25:08 pm »
Jes, that's a good post re Hendricks. 

"Hitting is timing, pitching is the destruction of timing."  Hendricks does that incredibly well, which is why his WAR is as it is.

Some here have essentially admitted in their comments that to them, being an ace requires lighting up a radar gun.... and, interestingly, these are often folks who not only embrace sabermetrics, but they ridicule those who may not share the same enthusiasm about some of the manufactured stats.... and then they ignore actual performance in favor of a reading on a radar gun.

I do really hope the Cubs sign Darvish, but not because I think he will be better than Hendricks, and if he were going to be reliably better than Hendricks has been over the last two years, the bidding war would likely cause the Theocracy to wisely walk away.

craig

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1117 on: December 19, 2017, 11:07:58 pm »
For Darvish, I'd think Houston being in home-state of Texas would be to their advantage.  So might his post-season experience:  Darvish and his Dodgers staff totally dominated the Cubs hitters, but the tenacious Houston hitters totally dominated him and beat up the good Dodgers staff pretty well.  He may figure the Astros hitters are going to take the team farther than the Cubs hitters can?  Advantage Houston?

I'd think the short LF fence in Houston would be unappealing.  Disadvantage Houston. 
Racist stuff from Gurriel. Is that the kind of clubhouse culture he wants to be a part of?  Disadvantage Houston?

Theo and Maddon might make a better sales pitch.  Advantage Cubs?

$$$$  Who knows? 

CurtOne

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1118 on: December 19, 2017, 11:20:50 pm »
I think it is less than encouraging that he even wants to talk to others after an "excellent" meeting with the Cubs.

CurtOne

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JR

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Jes Beard

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1121 on: December 20, 2017, 12:00:01 am »
I'd love to see the Cubs take a chance on him.  Though I don't know where they would use him if they also sign Darvish and everyone is healthy, it is not all that normal for an entire starting rotation to be healthy.

Playtwo

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Ron

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1123 on: December 20, 2017, 11:36:41 am »
Hoyer downplays the significance of meeting with Yu Darvish, saying they meet with a lot of players during the winter.

https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses/943531874063970304
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DelMarFan

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Re: Cubs in '18
« Reply #1124 on: December 20, 2017, 12:21:54 pm »
I'll be pretty surprised if Schwarber is traded.

I'll be a bit surprised if any of the core guys are traded.  It doesn't seem like any of the "trade a guy for controllable young starting pitching" scenarios are worth it. 
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