Author Topic: Cubs in '20  (Read 49142 times)

craig

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #615 on: November 06, 2019, 10:30:06 am »
I recall the father of a Cubs minor-league prospect was very uncomplimentary of Strode back in his Midwest League coaching days.  Suggested back in those days that Strode didn't provide any strategic or mechanical instruction.  That his level of "coaching" was "throw it harder!!" 
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Bennett

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #616 on: November 06, 2019, 10:47:13 am »
Strode bio makes it sound like he knew something about teaching pitching

http://m.cubs.mlb.com/chc/roster/coach/506427/lester-strode

CUBluejays

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #617 on: November 06, 2019, 11:20:42 am »
Strode seemed like somebody the Cubs valued, but he's been around such a long time sometimes change is good.  I'd be more worried about Borzello.

Young is much more in the Tommy Hottovoy mold. 
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Ron

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #618 on: November 06, 2019, 12:08:51 pm »
Sharma has a new piece on what to expect from the Cubs over the winter.  Not really that much to it, but he does emphasize comments by both Theo and Ricketts to the effect that the focus over the winter will not simply be on the window that closes after 2021, but will very much be focused on the period beyond 2021.


https://theathletic.com/1353819/2019/11/06/sharma-cubs-seem-ready-to-make-big-moves-but-dont-count-on-them-spending-big-money/?source=twittered

The most obvious move that would contribute to a long term strategy would be trading Kris Bryant (assuming the right deal).  He almost certainly will not be a Cub after 2021 (2020, if his grievance against the Cubs is successful).  And presumably he would also bring the most back to the Cubs. I know this would pi ss off a lot of fans, but I would think there is a pretty good chance of that happening (again, assuming the right deal).

Bennett

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #619 on: November 06, 2019, 12:57:09 pm »
Jon Heyman  @JonHeyman  47m47 minutes ago
Veteran Cubs bullpen coach Lester Strode won’t be back in that spot but has been offered another prominent position with the team. New manager David Ross is said to have someone else in mind for pen coach.


Prominent position?  The 3B coaching job is open

JR

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #620 on: November 06, 2019, 01:45:56 pm »
They might kick him upstairs to some special assistant to the GM type role. 

It'd be nice if they found a good role for him to stay in the organization.

CUBluejays

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #621 on: November 06, 2019, 02:07:01 pm »
Sharma has a new piece on what to expect from the Cubs over the winter.  Not really that much to it, but he does emphasize comments by both Theo and Ricketts to the effect that the focus over the winter will not simply be on the window that closes after 2021, but will very much be focused on the period beyond 2021.


https://theathletic.com/1353819/2019/11/06/sharma-cubs-seem-ready-to-make-big-moves-but-dont-count-on-them-spending-big-money/?source=twittered

The most obvious move that would contribute to a long term strategy would be trading Kris Bryant (assuming the right deal).  He almost certainly will not be a Cub after 2021 (2020, if his grievance against the Cubs is successful).  And presumably he would also bring the most back to the Cubs. I know this would pi ss off a lot of fans, but I would think there is a pretty good chance of that happening (again, assuming the right deal).

If the Cubs trade Bryant people are going to be shocked on how little they get for him.
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guest61

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #622 on: November 06, 2019, 02:56:41 pm »
They'll **** regardless but I bet it won't be a bad haul.


Reb

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #623 on: November 06, 2019, 03:10:35 pm »
If the Cubs trade Bryant people are going to be shocked on how little they get for him.

Kiley McDaniel said today in his chat that the likely return for Bryant would be two back-end top 100 prospect guys. That would be the equivalent of somebody else's Miguel Amaya and Bralyn Marquez---except we might not know much of anything about those two guys in a different organization and probably would be equivalent guys closer to the majors.

Think that would qualify as a big disappointment/shock for Cubs fans as a return for Bryant.

Don't see Theo going that route if that's the return.  Cubs want to win the World Series in 2020 and hard to see how trading Bryant for that kind of return is helpful. To replace him at 3B with David Bote?  No.


craig

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #624 on: November 06, 2019, 03:26:06 pm »
Sharma ....emphasize comments by both Theo and Ricketts to the effect that the focus over the winter will not simply be on the window that closes after 2021, but will very much be focused on the period beyond 2021....

The most obvious move that would contribute to a long term strategy would be trading Kris Bryant (assuming the right deal).  He almost certainly will not be a Cub after 2021 ... And presumably he would also bring the most back to the Cubs. ....I would think there is a pretty good chance of that happening (again, assuming the right deal

If the Cubs trade Bryant people are going to be shocked on how little they get for him.

*If* Bryant isn't interested in extending, Ron's idea of trading him for value that will endure beyond two years is logical.  (As Ron notes, "assuming the right deal".)  But Blue is right, "assuming the right deal" is the challenge.  We might be shocked at how little they get for him.  If you can't get that strong of an offer, does it still make sense to deal? 

As a 2-year rental with salary, I'm not sure how strong the trade value is.  *IF* the grievance thing has a real chance and he might actually be only a one-year rental, the value is less.  As a Boras baby, acquire-and-extend-at-hometown-discount doesn't apply.  He was 24th in offensive WAR last year, really good; but it's been three years since he was a top-10-offensive-WAR guy. 

Deeg

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #625 on: November 06, 2019, 03:32:42 pm »
Trading Bryant is effectively impossible as long as the grievance is unresolved, so for the moment at least this discussion is probably moot.

CurtOne

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #626 on: November 06, 2019, 03:48:41 pm »
It may be moot until several 3B FA's are determined.   

Ron

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #627 on: November 06, 2019, 03:55:37 pm »
Don't see Theo going that route if that's the return.  Cubs want to win the World Series in 2020 and hard to see how trading Bryant for that kind of return is helpful. To replace him at 3B with David Bote?  No.

I certainly agree with that.

CUBluejays

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #628 on: November 06, 2019, 04:20:32 pm »
On a Bryant trade, say for instance you want Jo Adell from the Angels.  Bryant is owed say $43 million for his 2 years of control.  If 1 WAR =$9 million, the Angels would have to value Bryant as a 6 WAR player.  If they do then the value of a 1:1 trade could line up.  The more likely scenario is Bryant is valued at 4-5 WAR player and his surplus value is $29-47 million.  So you could get a back-end top 100 guy and a 2-3 WAR player with control.  The Red Sox are going to be in the same bind trying to unload Betts. 

Reb

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Re: Cubs in '20
« Reply #629 on: November 06, 2019, 05:20:06 pm »
Bryant is likely going to have two years of control because don't see him winning the grievance absent some evidence we don't know about.  Cubs figure to be a legit contender for both those seasons.

With two years, makes no sense to me to trade him for an average regular and a back-end top 100 prospect.  If one year of control (like Betts), that would be different, maybe.

It's not like Indians and Lindor.  Indians have basically zero chance to re-sign him when he hits free agency in two years.  Cubs can make a competitive offer to keep Bryant in two years.  In the meantime, hard to see merits of weakening club in short-run for those two seasons when you're trying to win the WS. 

Would also be different if you could get a return of a plus major league ready guy(s) now for Bryant and fill 3B with another good player, either by trade or free agency, and gain some years of control in the Bryant package.  In the end, hard to evaluate without seeing who the actual players may be.