Author Topic: Cubs in '22  (Read 41959 times)

ben

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #45 on: August 18, 2021, 05:40:11 pm »
Who knows about future performance, but I'd love to see us re-sign Hendricks (assuming his performance doesn't crater soon) because:

* some guys who can really pitch - without relying on 95+ - have an opportunity to stick around a bit longer.  I may be WAY off, but my guess is he will continue to make adjustments and remain a solid starter into his mid-30s.

* He could really help others of our pitchers as a role model in his prep and how he thinks about pitching.

* He's established himself as a big-game pitcher and those guys are very few and far between.

* His ERA may not be real great this season (thanks in part to a slow start and a couple of BAD games), but he's 14-5 with our crappy team!  W/L record is just one data point among many, but it tends to favor guys who can really compete.  Hendricks is one of those pitchers.

* He was very reasonable in negotiations last time, which may suggest he will be again, and having at least some team stability would have to be of assistance to some other players and, certainly, the fan base.  Plus, he's a solid guy who will very likely always represent the team well.

We've been damned lucky to have had Hendricks these past few years and I certainly hope he can stick around and do his rather inimitable thing for us for a few more years.

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method

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #46 on: August 18, 2021, 07:04:18 pm »
Sign him to a good deal, then trade him, thats when his value will be the highest. see Quintana.

CUBluejays

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #47 on: August 18, 2021, 07:41:40 pm »
33 and 34!  Hell, just euthanize him.

Seems extreme.

Jack Birdbath

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2021, 10:45:37 pm »
Sammy Sosa is not in the new Cubs Hall of Fame. This grudge that Ricketts has against him is very odd.
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chgojhawk

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #49 on: August 19, 2021, 07:46:15 am »
I would move both Hendricks and Contreras for whatever we can get for them.

Theo was looking to move Hendricks during (and right after) the WS season. There was concern that his 88 mph fastball was down in the 85-86 range and was getting knocked around. If Hendricks loses anything off his fastball he is about done.

There have been a couple handfuls of pitchers who have worked effectively in the MLB over the last 15 years while throwing in the upper 80s. I canít think of one that threw in the mid 80s (or lower). Knuckleball pitchers donít count (unless Hendricks has one in his bag of tricks).

I love Willson but there is a shelf life on all players, especially catchers. We can collect some assets for him now. We wonít have that luxury when we run him out there over the next few non competitive seasons and with a big contract.

We arenít competing for a few years so no point to spend on aging players. Might as well collect assets.

Guessing we will keep Hendricks through his current contract and Contreras will be traded at the deadline next year.

Robb

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #50 on: August 20, 2021, 10:31:53 am »
What is everyone hoping for this off-season? I think realistically the Cubs sign a big ticket starter and position player.  For me,  Correa and Stroman would be about as good as could be expected. 

chgojhawk

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #51 on: August 20, 2021, 01:24:44 pm »
What is everyone hoping for this off-season? I think realistically the Cubs sign a big ticket starter and position player.  For me,  Correa and Stroman would be about as good as could be expected.

Very good question.  I'm not sure anyone decent will sign with us unless we give way more money than a team that may have a chance to compete. 

On one hand I could see the team spend and pick up 5 nice players for a quick rebuild, but I know that won't happen.  On the other hand standing pat, then trading competitive parts, having the worst record in baseball and getting the #1 pick seems more likely.

Since you asked what I would like to see (and trying to be somewhat realistic)......I would like to see us spend enough to be competitive and have a chance to sneak into the playoffs while excelling in international signings to continue rebuilding the farm system

craig

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #52 on: August 20, 2021, 03:52:00 pm »
One of the questions in the rebuild will be the next CBA.  Theo and Hoyer several times mentioned that cba changes really curtailed their intended process with the previous Cubs rebuild.  They got Soler signed before things changed.  Bit then the concept of investing big in draft and IFA (while perhaps spending less on the big-league roster) was taken away.  The loss of draft picks for signing good FA's was also a factor; for signing Heyward and Zobrist, they lost their top two draft picks in 2016.  (Michael Rucker is the only pick from that draft to reach the majors, Tom Hatch was the Cubs first selection.).  Because the CBA had removed draft compensation for players traded mid-season, they were able to sign Lester without losing their pick in 2015, which resulted in Ian Happ.  Subsequent changes made it so that even had we held onto Baez/Bryzzo, compensation picks would be a round later than in days past. 

Hoyer is not wrong to acknowledge that it's difficult to know exactly what options will make sense without knowing what the new CBA looks like.  Do you want to sign FA's to make next year more competitive, while costing draft picks each?  Will you be losing your top pick, or only subsequent selections? 

My guess is that the union itself doesn't care too much about IFA or the draft, so long as teams are prevented from diverting big-league salary to amateur procurement.  So I'd guess the players won't have much motivation to change the draft or IFA.  So, good chance that there will be some modification to the current system, but it might not be very radical. 

There has been talk of instituting an IFA draft.  Between the two parties, I'm not sure which side would push very hard for that, though?  Maybe some of the smaller-market owners, wanting better parity?  That's been mentioned often, but I'm not sure of all of the things the two parties care about economically, I'm not sure IFA-draft would fall within the top 100 issues for either side.  (And probably even within the owners, there'd likely be divergent views on that.).

From the players side, one small modification that I'd suggest would be to remove any draft-choice penalty for teams who sign FA's.  Players know that a rebuilding under-spending team like the Cubs has a conflict.  We want to sign FA's to get better; but we value draft picks as a way to get better, too.  Penalizing and disincentivizing the Cubs for signing FA's does not encourage them to spend, or to even make competitive offers that drive up offers.  There was some penalty-moderation in the last CBA, I think, but erasing any penalty would make sense to me.  That would make it easier for a team like the Cubs to use BOTH draft AND FA to rebuild, and I don't think the Cubs are unique in that. 

I still think there is competitive-balance reasons to retain some level of compensation picks.  if you lose a guy, get a comp pick; but don't penalize the team who signs a FA.  That would be best for players and spending, I think.  Personally I almost think bringing back comp picks after the first round instead of only the 2nd might actually benefit both competitive-balance and perhaps do the players as much good as harm.

Deeg

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #53 on: August 20, 2021, 06:50:20 pm »
Trade Hendricks and Contreras for the best possible return and sign at least 2-3 FAs to 1 and 2-year deals that can be flipped at the deadline.

method

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #54 on: August 20, 2021, 07:31:48 pm »
There is no way the Cubs sign a single FA that has a QO as such top tier FA like Correa and Stroman are off the board.

So its tier two guys on 1-2 year deals, that can be traded at the deadline.

Robb

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #55 on: August 20, 2021, 07:34:35 pm »
Aren't the top 15 picks protected?

craig

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #56 on: August 20, 2021, 07:53:11 pm »
Aren't the top 15 picks protected?

Yes, under current cba. 

CUBluejays

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #57 on: August 20, 2021, 08:12:55 pm »
Sharma/Mooney/Taylor discussed this on onto Waveland
-they except some teams to try and jump the market before the CBA is finalized. The really donít they no this will be the Cubs
- they doubt the Cubs get into the Correra/Stroman tier
- maybe they will overpay on short term deals, but Hoyer doesnít have a budget yet.


My guess is they have to have somewhat of a team to sell to fans to get season tickets sold.
My ideal is Synderguard, Conforto on prove it deals and 1 more starting pitcher with a couple veteran relievers and 1-2 more hitters. All on 1 years deals.

My fear is crap starting pitching and Baez coming back.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2021, 08:36:20 pm by CUBluejays »

Reb

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #58 on: August 20, 2021, 08:30:54 pm »
There is no way the Cubs sign a single FA that has a QO as such top tier FA like Correa and Stroman are off the board.

So its tier two guys on 1-2 year deals, that can be traded at the deadline.

Stroman is ineligible for a QO. Ditto Gausman.

Of course, nobody has any clue what kind of FAs Cubs are going to pursue.

My guess is that Cubs are going to be very reluctant to lose that 2nd round pick under current cba rules. Thatís a low 40s overall pick. But, could see spending on Stroman (or Gausman), as that probably doesnít come into play pending new cba.

Playtwo

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Re: Cubs in '22
« Reply #59 on: August 23, 2021, 11:19:21 am »
I'm guilty of the same thing that Brett Taylor is confessing to- assuming Hoerner is a lock to be a starter for us down the road. I'm less certain now.

https://www.bleachernation.com/cubs/2021/08/23/nico-hoerner-the-limits-of-planning-and-the-importance-of-flexibility/