Author Topic: Politics, Religion, etc.  (Read 66040 times)

CUBluejays

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4095 on: July 06, 2020, 01:20:47 pm »
This is an interesting update From Sweden. https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/

A couple of things they found in the data.

Even in global “hotspots”, the risk of death for the general population of school and working age is typically in the range of a daily car ride to work. The risk was initially overestimated because many people with only mild or no symptoms were not taken into account.

The median age of the deceased in most countries (including Italy) is over 80 years (e.g. 86 years in Sweden) and only about 4% of the deceased had no serious preconditions. The age and risk profile of deaths thus essentially corresponds to normal mortality.

In many countries, up to two thirds of all extra deaths occurred in nursing homes, which do not benefit from a general lockdown. Moreover, in many cases it is not clear whether these people really died from Covid19 or from weeks of extreme stress and isolation.
Up to 30% of all additional deaths may have been caused not by Covid19, but by the effects of the lockdown, panic and fear. For example, the treatment of heart attacks and strokes decreased by up to 60% because many patients no longer dared to go to hospital.

Even in so-called “Covid19 deaths” it is often not clear whether they died from or with coronavirus (i.e. from underlying diseases) or if they were counted as “presumed cases” and not tested at all. However, official figures usually do not reflect this distinction.
Many media reports of young and healthy people dying from Covid19 turned out to be false: many of these young people either did not die from Covid19, they had already been seriously ill (e.g. from undiagnosed leukaemia), or they were in fact 109 instead of 9 years old. The claimed increase in Kawasaki disease in children also turned out to be false.

Countries without curfews and contact bans, such as Japan, South Korea, Belarus or Sweden, have not experienced a more negative course of events than other countries. Sweden was even praised by the WHO and now benefits from higher immunity compared to lockdown countries.
The fear of a shortage of ventilators was unjustified. According to lung specialists, the invasive ventilation (intubation) of Covid19 patients, which is partly done out of fear of spreading the virus, is in fact often counterproductive and damaging to the lungs.

Numerous internationally renowned experts in the fields of virology, immunology and epidemiology consider the measures taken to be counterproductive and recommend rapid natural immunisation of the general population and protection of risk groups.

All of these findings are referenced at the link. It is hard for people to know what to believe when there are reputable sources on both sides saying the exact opposite. Would be nice if this weren't political. I played golf with my doctor Friday and he spent most of the round talking about the faults with what the media is reporting and what is being done to treat it. I am sure there is something of a confirmation bias going on with people on the right and left. In the middle are those being hurt by misinformation from both ends. This is where a truly unbiased media would be nice to have, even crucial. But because half the country, at least, doesn't trust them to research and report the facts without a slant, people are ignoring what they are telling us, and chaos ensues.

-Swedens's death per 100,000 people has increased to roughly twice what the US has experienced despite being healthier and younger than the US.
-Sweden isn't anywhere close to herd immunity and there isn't any data avaiable that getting infected with result in immunity that could last past a few months.
-There isn't data on what the long term effects are people that don't die from the disease on how it will affect them.  Just because younger people don't die it doesn't mean this is harmless
-The article the sited about kids is from April.  There is more recent studies that COVID is the cause of this in kids.
-It says it is written by a doctor, but the doctor doesn't actually put his name to it.  The Swiss Policy Research that put this out definitely has a slant if you dig through their website.
-This is a virus that we haven't seen before.  The answers to many of these questions are determined and the people that are ignoring what is being said are either young and stupid or Trumpers.  You can let the data lead you, but your going to have to be willing to change your mind and admit that you are wrong.  Answers are going to change, because it is constantly changing.
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CUBluejays

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4096 on: July 06, 2020, 01:54:41 pm »
Also a personal pet peeve.

People that want to compare the fatality rates between the flu and COVID are demanding 2 separate standards for each virus.  The flu deaths given by the CDC are estimated and not confirmed cases.  If you go with just confirmed cases the total is much, much, much smaller.  For COVID the demand confirmed cases only and then if they have a co-morbidity they want to pawn it off on the co-morbidity.  It is pretty easy to tell the difference somebody that dies from leukemia vs COVID.
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Jack Birdbath

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4097 on: July 06, 2020, 02:33:58 pm »
Also a personal pet peeve.

People that want to compare the fatality rates between the flu and COVID are demanding 2 separate standards for each virus.  The flu deaths given by the CDC are estimated and not confirmed cases.  If you go with just confirmed cases the total is much, much, much smaller.  For COVID the demand confirmed cases only and then if they have a co-morbidity they want to pawn it off on the co-morbidity.  It is pretty easy to tell the difference somebody that dies from leukemia vs COVID.

You should explain that to Pekin.  He seems open minded and reasonable.
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CUBluejays

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4098 on: July 06, 2020, 07:12:40 pm »
You should explain that to Pekin.  He seems open minded and reasonable.

He’d love my dad’s family.

Jack Birdbath

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4099 on: July 06, 2020, 07:24:56 pm »
He’d love my dad’s family.

Do you hear stuff like this from your dad’s family?

Who cares how many cases there are if the hospitalizations and deaths don't go up.  Corona is literally the common cold.  So if they are doing antibody tests and it comes back positive you could just have anti bodies from being exposed to the common cold.

Plus every test is coming back positive right now for some strange reason.  I have seen multiple posts from people who scheduled tests but never went then got a positive result back.  Posts from nurses who send in tests kits that have never been used coming back positive.

If you test positive they ask you to come back every few days to get tested again.  Each time you test positive they count it as a new case.

A guy my wife works with recently moved to Arizona and is going to work remotely.  He and his entire family got it.  A few days of feeling crappy then they were fine.

The numbers are being manipulated to try and shut the economy down again to keep President Trump from being re-elected.  Yes they are that corrupt.

The left, the MSM and the deep state (I repeat myself) along with foreign actors worked together to lock us down to take away our freedoms and destroy our economy.  All so the Democrats could regain power.

Covid 19 was never more deadly then a bad flu season.  They just pumped up the numbers to scare the public into going along with their bullshit.

CUBluejays

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4100 on: July 06, 2020, 08:34:14 pm »
Do you hear stuff like this from your dad’s family?


Seems tame for uncle who I called a **** moron on Facebook before I blocked him. I also asked my dad if we where actually biologically related to them. This didn’t prompt anger from dad, just a shrug that he didn’t want to live in small town Iowa early on in life.

Bennett

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4101 on: July 07, 2020, 12:35:28 am »
Quote
WASHINGTON (AP) — Forty lobbyists with ties to President Donald Trump helped clients secure more than $10 billion in federal coronavirus aid, among them five former administration officials whose work potentially violates Trump’s own ethics policy, according to a report.

https://apnews.com/2edf8670a491a702ecfb7312f507f83a

DelMarFan

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4102 on: July 07, 2020, 12:44:44 am »
Quote
Forty lobbyists with ties to President Donald Trump helped clients secure more than $10 billion in federal coronavirus aid, among them five former administration officials whose work potentially violates Trump’s own ethics policy

I'm sure they need it to fight the Deep State Conspiracy

CurtOne

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CurtOne

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4104 on: July 07, 2020, 02:37:00 pm »
Wonder what has changed his mind?  Couldn't be pandering to his support, right?

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020/07/07/trump-confederate-flag-museum-2015-comment-newday-vpx.cnn



brjones

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4107 on: July 08, 2020, 06:55:17 pm »
Bad COVID report today:

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1281009997254742021

You can excuse the high death total yesterday because the count was catching up after the holiday weekend. But over 800 deaths today with 62,000 new cases...that's bad.

It's just one day and maybe some of the holiday weekend backlog was also cleared today. But this week and next are key for learning if we're going to be able to maintain the lower death rate despite the surge in cases over the last month...and today is not a good sign.

CUBluejays

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4108 on: July 08, 2020, 07:01:37 pm »
Bad COVID report today:

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1281009997254742021

You can excuse the high death total yesterday because the count was catching up after the holiday weekend. But over 800 deaths today with 62,000 new cases...that's bad.

It's just one day and maybe some of the holiday weekend backlog was also cleared today. But this week and next are key for learning if we're going to be able to maintain the lower death rate despite the surge in cases over the last month...and today is not a good sign.

The backlog would have cleared Monday.  The fact the the positive % is going up is really bad.
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Bennett

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Re: Politics, Religion, etc.
« Reply #4109 on: July 08, 2020, 07:05:38 pm »
The phrase "crisis standard of care" is now being heard some.  It sounds like a fancy way of saying triage.

A doctor on TV this morning may have been a little overly dramatic when he said you might hear "We can't help you.  Go home to die."