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Author Topic: Cubs in '13 1/15/13 - 6/11/13  (Read 55351 times)

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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1470 on: May 30, 2013, 02:00:08 pm »
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I really hope that the Cubs future rotation doesn't include Feldman just because they have better options.

I was thinking more along the lines of a 2 year extension.  I really don't want Feldman long term either.  I'm thinking more along the lines of having someone to get us through the next season or two until we start developing better players.

But again, it's just a random thought, not something I'm really advocating.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2013, 02:03:44 pm by JR »
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1471 on: May 30, 2013, 06:41:52 pm »
If they were smart they'd trade Feldman now, because he's going to look a lot better than a guy with a 4.5 ERA at the deadline.

Garza is clearly the guy with the best potential return, if he should miraculously stay healthy.  A legit #2 starter, even as a rental, could be worth a lot to a team with big dreams and a weak rotation.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1472 on: May 30, 2013, 08:03:48 pm »
Quote from: Deeg on May 30, 2013, 06:41:52 pm
If they were smart they'd trade Feldman now, because he's going to look a lot better than a guy with a 4.5 ERA at the deadline.

Garza is clearly the guy with the best potential return, if he should miraculously stay healthy.  A legit #2 starter, even as a rental, could be worth a lot to a team with big dreams and a weak rotation.

"Now" meaning June 15, I suppose.  Complicated to trade a FA sign like Feldman before that date under the CBA.  Go ask Curt. 

I guess I see the argument for trading a pending FA like Feldman but I don't really want to see the rotation gutted like last season and watch the embarrassments Cubs were sending out to pitch late last season.  Two years in a row of that?  No thanks.

As to Garza, hard to see why his trade value would be any better than Dempster a year ago.  Dempster had an ERA of 2.25 when traded and best offer Cubs got for him was Randall Delgado---currently with the 6.84 ERA at AAA. 

I think Cubs should keep Garza, go all-out to sign him in the off-season, and if they can't sign him, make him a qualifying offer and net the draft pick.  How much more, if anything, is Randall Delgado (or the Rangers package) worth compared to a pick between #30-35?  I think Garza is a keeper.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1473 on: May 30, 2013, 08:20:24 pm »
Garza has better stuff and is younger than Dempster.  He'll also likely be the best pitcher on the market.  All of those will lead to a better package.  If you trade him to a small market team he'll hit free agency and you could still sign him.  Dempster would have come back if the Cubs wanted him.  The comp picks are really lottery tickets so more advanced prospects are going to have a better chance of reaching the majors.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1474 on: May 30, 2013, 08:36:08 pm »
Agree, Garza is much younger than Dempster.  A team who wanted him now could try to extend before trade (Dempster's refusal to do so was a factor in why nobody offered better.)  Garza may or may not be interested, but even so a team could figure that if they like him and if they bring him into a good clubhouse and a winning situation, that he'll be interested in extending later if not right away. 

But, you aren't going to expect to get top talent for 2-month rentals.  The expectation that Garza is going to bring some major haul of talent, that opportunity came and went two winters ago. 

I'm not at all sure that you can get a better prospect for a 2-month rental than you'd get as a comp pick. 
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1475 on: May 30, 2013, 08:38:18 pm »
The rotation also won't be as big of a mess.  Baker will be coming back, Villaneuva might not get traded.  In the minors Russin, Raley, and Caberera could pitch.  Samardijiza isn't getting shut down either.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1476 on: May 30, 2013, 08:51:04 pm »
Quote from: CUBluejays on May 30, 2013, 08:20:24 pm
Garza has better stuff and is younger than Dempster.  He'll also likely be the best pitcher on the market.  All of those will lead to a better package.  If you trade him to a small market team he'll hit free agency and you could still sign him.  Dempster would have come back if the Cubs wanted him.  The comp picks are really lottery tickets so more advanced prospects are going to have a better chance of reaching the majors.

Yes, Garza has better stuff and is younger---that's exactly why I think he's a keeper. 

A club trading for him wants help now to put them over the top. Age is a longer term factor. Dempster was in a groove a year ago.  I'm not sure why Cubs would have got more for Dempster if Greinke was not on the market.

In any case, threshold question is whether Garza is a keeper or not. Really unlikely you can bring him back this off-season if you trade him. How often does that happen.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1477 on: May 30, 2013, 09:08:03 pm »
Pretty convenient and disingenuous to use Delgado's struggles this season to pretend he wasn't considered a huge prize at the deadline last year.  Hindsight is 20-20, eh?
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1478 on: May 30, 2013, 09:10:58 pm »
Quote from: CUBluejays on May 30, 2013, 08:38:18 pm
The rotation also won't be as big of a mess.  Baker will be coming back, Villaneuva might not get traded.  In the minors Russin, Raley, and Caberera could pitch.  Samardijiza isn't getting shut down either.

Well, Rusin, Raley, Cabrera were up last season and the first two got starts and were horrific. I hope Scott Baker can pitch, but who knows.  Probably can't be as bad as late last season but one injury to somebody who stays---and watch out.

I can see trading DeJesus and perhaps Feldman but don't want to see a fire sale.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1479 on: May 30, 2013, 09:15:22 pm »
They should try to extend Feldman and Baker, and if they can't, then trade them for whatever they can get.  Garza should probably be kept, and if they can't extend him, make a qualifying offer.  Anyone else who has a contract ending this year that can not be extended (of if they don't want to extend it) trade for whoever we can get.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1480 on: May 30, 2013, 09:21:46 pm »
Quote from: Deeg on May 30, 2013, 09:08:03 pm
Pretty convenient and disingenuous to use Delgado's struggles this season to pretend he wasn't considered a huge prize at the deadline last year.  Hindsight is 20-20, eh?

Disingenuous to point out the guy's actual numbers? Give me a break.

I never thought Delgado was worth much more than the Rangers package. Guess not so for those who wanted to string up Dempster for invoking his contractual rights.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1481 on: May 30, 2013, 09:36:49 pm »
Garza likes Chicago and I'm sure if Theo set him down and said, "We're trying to build a World Series team and we think you can be part of that.  We have an opportunity to trade you for a great young player that might help us get to the World Series.  When you hit free agency we really want you to be part of this team long term."

You get more by getting multiple teams to bid on Garza.  Dempster was going to bring in a highly thought of pitcher until he vetoed the trade and said send me to the Dodgers.  When that didn't work out at the last minute he said ok to Texas and the Yankees.  Dempster did far more to kill his value.  Tyler Skaggs who a lot of posters also liked has a 5.23 ERA for the same AAA and Delgado was over 9 for awhile.  If the D-Backs want to dump him, I'd be on the phone quickly.

Shark, Wood, Villanuenva, Baker, Rusin/Raley/Cabrera >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wood/Germano/Berken/Volstad/Raley/Rusin.  Rusin has been pitching well in Spring Training/AAA.  Caberera has been doing well in AA and has nasty stuff.  His issue was control and it seems to have improved this year.  Raley has decent junk lefty stuff, but I'd like him more as LOOGY. 

I just want to get a lot more talent in this organization and another high pick, increased IFA (or high draft picks), and a fire sale will go a long way towards getting that critical mass of talent.  Not everybody is going to work out, that is why you need a big quantity of high end talent.  This needs to be the last year of sucking though, because if it continues the Cubs are going to start to lose revenue.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1482 on: May 30, 2013, 10:50:41 pm »
I'm not sure what the definition of tampering is, but I suspect that that would not be included in it.

But unless Theo told the team he was trading Garza to about that conversation, I would certainly consider it unethical, and I suspect that most other GMs would consider it to be that also.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1483 on: May 30, 2013, 11:13:21 pm »
You can't tamper with players on your team.  I'm not suggesting the hammer out an extension, just that the door is open for him to come back.  Unethical, I don't really think so.  If the team he is traded to wants to sign him they just have to make an offer he can't refuse or beat out other teams competing for his service in free agency. 

Ryan Dempster on 8/1/12 gave an interview to ESPN that basically said hey I'd really like to go back to Cubs.  I don't think the Rangers cared about it.
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Re: Cubs in '13
« Reply #1484 on: May 30, 2013, 11:38:42 pm »
Perhaps this is Valbuena's high-water mark...whatever the case, his stats after 125 ABs sure are good.
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